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  • 165. Re: JavaOne 2012: JavaFX on iOS, Android and Windows 8 Metro???
    99443 Newbie
    Currently Being Moderated
    codnameone seems to support a limited/old part of the java platform.

    -------------Begin Quote -------------http://www.codenameone.com/faq.html---------------------------------

    Can I Use The Full Java SE API & Language Features?

    You can use a subset of Java 5 and some API's (e.g. collections, threads etc.).
    We don't support the entire API due to limitations of some of the target platforms and to keep the iOS port small.

    ------------End quote-----------------------------------------

    There is no mention of JavaFX in this. Would this mean that the 'byte-code' generated from JavaFX would work in this environment ?. Probably not. (guessing)

    Comments ?.

    /rk
  • 166. Re: JavaOne 2012: JavaFX on iOS, Android and Windows 8 Metro???
    JonathanGiles Journeyer
    Currently Being Moderated
    Hi all,

    Richard, Jasper and I just posted a survey that anyone wanting JavaFX on embedded, mobile and tablet devices should fill in. Your feedback will be heard!

    Visit our website here: http://fxexperience.com/2012/12/javafx-for-tablets-mobile/

    Thanks!
    -- Jonathan
  • 167. Re: JavaOne 2012: JavaFX on iOS, Android and Windows 8 Metro???
    Tobi Newbie
    Currently Being Moderated
    Hi Jonathan,

    very good idea! Thanks!

    btw: When did you plan to open source the iOS prototype?
  • 168. Re: JavaOne 2012: JavaFX on iOS, Android and Windows 8 Metro???
    969259 Newbie
    Currently Being Moderated
    We should all promote this survey! I have posted a link to the survey in stackoverflow.com, and wrote to TechCrunch giving them a tip for the story. It is difficult to get a story on TC but maybe if more people give them the same tip, they will pay more attention to it? This is our chance as a community to show that we really want this!
  • 169. Re: JavaOne 2012: JavaFX on iOS, Android and Windows 8 Metro???
    978711 Newbie
    Currently Being Moderated
    Everyone in this thread needs to realize this has nothing to do with Oracle. If Apple said they would allow the Java JVM on iOS, you know that Oracle would drop everything they were doing and get started on it tomorrow.

    JavaFX on Android wouldn't be that difficult, but Oracle did create some... tensions... between themselves and Google after that last little lawsuit. I also believe JavaFX already works on Windows Mobile. But the real problem here is that Apple is incredible strict about 3rd runtime environments (Google Chrome for iOS can't even use their V8 javascript renderer http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2406477,00.asp).

    What needs to happen is for Oracle to make nice with Google and provide amazing support for Java on Android as well work with Windows Mobile. No one wants to learn Objective-C just to release an App for one market. In JavaFX becomes popular enough on Android and Windows Mobile then Apple will be pressured into allowing Java. That's the only way Apple with ever allow Java on iOS.
  • 170. Re: JavaOne 2012: JavaFX on iOS, Android and Windows 8 Metro???
    user9098138 Newbie
    Currently Being Moderated
    we can't open the site http://fxexperience.com in china!
  • 171. Re: JavaOne 2012: JavaFX on iOS, Android and Windows 8 Metro???
    975845 Newbie
    Currently Being Moderated
    975708 wrote:
    Everyone in this thread needs to realize this has nothing to do with Oracle. If Apple said they would allow the Java JVM on iOS, you know that Oracle would drop everything they were doing and get started on it tomorrow.

    JavaFX on Android wouldn't be that difficult, but Oracle did create some... tensions... between themselves and Google after that last little lawsuit. I also believe JavaFX already works on Windows Mobile. But the real problem here is that Apple is incredible strict about 3rd runtime environments (Google Chrome for iOS can't even use their V8 javascript renderer http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2406477,00.asp).

    What needs to happen is for Oracle to make nice with Google and provide amazing support for Java on Android as well work with Windows Mobile. No one wants to learn Objective-C just to release an App for one market. In JavaFX becomes popular enough on Android and Windows Mobile then Apple will be pressured into allowing Java. That's the only way Apple with ever allow Java on iOS.
    Well, this is not true at all.
    Ok, Apple does not provide a JVM, but you can use your own runtime enviornment since 2011 change of AppStore regulations. The only thing that is needed is a fully bundled runtime. Thats why flash, mono and a bunch of more runtimes have been ported to iOS. In other words, as long as you act as a native binary and you don't break any sandboxing rules and you don's break major desgn guidelines Apple doesn't care about your internals.

    That's why I cannot belive that V8 is not allowed on iOS, maybe Google just didn't want to bundle it. Or they didn't see any reason for doing so ;)

    What we need is an JVM (maybe not even that, because we already have enough portable JVMs like Davlik or ZeroVM) and open sourced JavaFX native libaries. I am quite sure we could integrate those libraries into a JVM pretty easily. From my point of view the JVM must not beeing fully optimized in the first step since the main task is done in OpenGL ES 2 and we could have native supported libaries to do the heavy work if needed. Thats why open sourced JavaFX might be enough in the first step.
  • 172. Re: JavaOne 2012: JavaFX on iOS, Android and Windows 8 Metro???
    ryan29 Explorer
    Currently Being Moderated
    975708 wrote:What needs to happen is for Oracle to make nice with Google and provide amazing support for Java on Android as well work with Windows Mobile. No one wants to learn Objective-C just to release an App for one market. In JavaFX becomes popular enough on Android and Windows Mobile then Apple will be pressured into allowing Java. That's the only way Apple with ever allow Java on iOS.
    I agree with this basic sentiment. I would love to see Apple forced into changing the way they treat developers. Whether or not that's possible is another discussion.

    The entire mobile space seems to be more about business politics than anything. Apple offers an enterprise developer program, but it's not exactly developer friendly. I was just reading through their docs to see how it works and this jumps out at me.
    When your distribution certificate expires, the app won’t launch. Your distribution certificate is valid for three years from when it was issued, or until your Enterprise Developer Program membership expires, whichever comes first.
    Based on my own limited observations the people 'investing' in iOS seem to be government organizations. They're not playing with their own money and they're not investing, they're spending.

    Java(FX) has a lot of developer mind-share. I think if Oracle drew a line in the sand and made JavaFX officially available on all the open platforms, it could be beneficial, especially if they were vocal enough about the reasons. iOS is a high risk platform for business applications and bending over backwards to keep Apple in control isn't good for anyone.

    Am I the only one that thinks developing (native) business apps for iOS is completely insane? Am I overstating the risk?
  • 173. Re: JavaOne 2012: JavaFX on iOS, Android and Windows 8 Metro???
    969259 Newbie
    Currently Being Moderated
    I develop business apps for iOS and it is not as bad as you describe it. Without a certificate, it is impossible to install your app on an iOS device (unless you jailbreak it). You will need to buy a certificate no matter what language you develop in, but it is just $99/year. If you are selling software to businesses then it is not a big deal.

    The only real pain is that the mainstream development language is Objective-C and, if you want to do something very iOS- specific, you can't escape it. We would face the same problem even if Oracle made the JVM available on iOS. For some things, the JNI bridge to Objective-C (or C, or C++) will be unavoidable. With a large user base, of course, someone will likely develop a library that you could use.

    As a sidenote: another drawback (and this is not iOS specific) is that the server technology (Java, Scala, C#) is probably different than the app technology (Objective-C, Flex, C#). At the moment, C# is the only language that is popular at both sides. I guess if Oracle doesn't implement the JVM on mobile devices soon, .Net will probably see an increase in developer population.

    iOS is not high risk for business applications. In a way, Apple is the new IBM (nobody got fired for buying an iPad). When large corporations invest in tablets, it is mostly iPads and not Android. If you are able to implement a business process with a simple to use, eye-catching iPad application, it is quite a safe bet that you will sell.

    For business applications, you don't necessarily have to distribute your app through the App Store. There is an enterprise in-house program that lets you company (or your client) sign applications for distribution on their devices. I have developed a couple of apps that use this model.

    I think the risk is low and there is money to be made. We just could use better tools.
  • 174. Re: JavaOne 2012: JavaFX on iOS, Android and Windows 8 Metro???
    980070 Newbie
    Currently Being Moderated
    I think there is no way.
    Android don't want Java on his platform to dont have concurrence on android app.
    And Oracle don't want it to don't have concurrence on adf.
    It's sad, i discover JavaFx this week, and i enjoyed creating new project on device and desktop..
    And finish with a bad, i discover adf today and i feel it bad.

    I wonder how Oracle will do money with javaFX.
  • 175. Re: JavaOne 2012: JavaFX on iOS, Android and Windows 8 Metro???
    969259 Newbie
    Currently Being Moderated
    This is a very interesting piece of documentation from the version of JavaFX that has just been released: http://docs.oracle.com/javafx/2/events/gestures.htm#CHDDHFJJ
    I hope the docs were not written just as a theoretical exercise!
  • 176. Re: JavaOne 2012: JavaFX on iOS, Android and Windows 8 Metro???
    alabala_kiril Newbie
    Currently Being Moderated
    @edko apparently, the Gesture events are currently targeted only for embeded devices with touch screen (http://marxsoftware.blogspot.com/2012/10/javaone-2012-javafx-smart-embedded-devices.html)

    I'm also curious about how Oracle will make money out of JavaFX now...yes - it's the new swing, but previous thread posts made it clear - swing apps are being migrated to HTML5 nowadays...and it's not because it's easy, clean and maintainable, but because it's cross-platform.

    Remember the dusty promise: "Write once, run everywhere" ?
  • 177. Re: JavaOne 2012: JavaFX on iOS, Android and Windows 8 Metro???
    jsmith Guru
    Currently Being Moderated
    apparently, the Gesture events are currently targeted only for embeded devices with touch screen
    That's wrong, they also work with the touchpad on my mac.
  • 178. Re: JavaOne 2012: JavaFX on iOS, Android and Windows 8 Metro???
    gimbal2 Guru
    Currently Being Moderated
    alabala_kiril wrote:
    I'm also curious about how Oracle will make money out of JavaFX now...yes - it's the new swing, but previous thread posts made it clear - swing apps are being migrated to HTML5 nowadays...and it's not because it's easy, clean and maintainable, but because it's cross-platform.
    They don't make money on JavaFX, they make money on Java. And not on Java directly but on the services surrounding it.
  • 179. Re: JavaOne 2012: JavaFX on iOS, Android and Windows 8 Metro???
    alabala_kiril Newbie
    Currently Being Moderated
    That's wrong, they also work with the touchpad on my mac.
    sure! embeded devices, desktop systems that provide touch support ... my point was that it's not just a "theoretical exercise"(as asked by @edko)
    They don't make money on JavaFX, they make money on Java. And not on Java directly but on the services surrounding it.
    We all know that Java is free and Oracle is selling services. However how can they sell JavaFX services if customers favor HTML5 over JavaFX? Andoird/iOS Support will give JavaFX a bigger chance to compete with rival technologies.

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