Dude wrote:I think you give them far too much credit. When you see the preponderance of people who don't even know what a command line is, the people who simply dump very plain error messages with the appearance of having not even attempted to read an understand, people who say "the documentation is too difficult for me", people who have been somewhat active for several years but appear to have learned nothing about either Oracle or general troubleshooting skills, people who blithely post their email address or critical connection information .... it's hard to believe they are clever enough to try to hide that they are using unlicensed software.
It might be a question of common sense or ignorance, but I do not believe that anyone able to find this forum does not know about the impact of software versions and providing a minimum of information. I don't know, but I can imagine that the majority of people who are not providing at least the version of Oracle software involved, are simply paranoid and afraid to provide such info, for instance, because they are using software features for which they have no licensing. As such they are just fishing for information and are mostly likely not interested in providing feedback either. Sometimes you may run into people who do not have a clue or are working beyond their abilities. Helping those can be challenging anyway and some do not even know what version of software they are using, or how to obtain such information.
Dude wrote:I think you're being too suspicious of people.
I think that most people who are not providing basic information, such as the product version, are withholding such information on purpose. Most of them are probably hoping to get by without giving out any information about themselves or what they are doing wrong. And to my experience, these people most likely do not want to provide feedback or invest much effort to find a solution anyway.
BluShadow wrote:Concur. People are not naturally sly (such as withholding version info). People are naturally lazy - and do not think/see pass their noses as it is too much of an effort.
I think you're being too suspicious of people.
Billy Verreynne wrote:pass => pastBluShadow wrote:Concur. People are not naturally sly (such as withholding version info). People are naturally lazy - and do not think/see pass their noses as it is too much of an effort.
I think you're being too suspicious of people.
Easily substantiated by postings asking the simplest of general questions, as it is too much effort to filter and read through Google results, or do a sqlplus test case, and easier to ask it instead on OTN and have others do the work for you...
PS. Blu, please edit and spell check the posting for me, cheers. :-)
Dude wrote:On the contrary, I find it easy to believe that people just forget or don't realise they need to add it or whatever; I've forgotten to add the version number on more than one occasion (usually despite the fact that I've said to myself "don't forget to put the version number in!" during the writing of the post!) - yes, I really am that forgetful. Sometimes you get too bogged down in your issue and, in your haste to try and put as much info out there, you forget to add the basics!
I find it too hard to believe that the majority of IT people posting here forgets to mention the product version because they are lazy or idjuts, or think its not important.
Dude wrote:Because sometimes you can get a quicker response from the people on the forum, and it may be more that they know it's just a lack of their own understanding than a bug or serious system issue. Most developers will seek help from other developers before calling directly on oracle support. Oracle support is mainly for issues where you have a live system that's got problems, or you've exhausted all standard avenues of finding the solution to your problem, such as interacting with other developers. Can you imagine how quickly issues would get supported if all the thousands of posts that we receive on these forums each day were just raised with Oracle support? Many of them would be low priority and takes days or weeks to get a response, and then everyone's support costs would go up (as if they're not enough already!).
Well, I'm suspicious of anything that seems strange to me. Why would someone you describe discuss a problem in a public forum rather than opening a SR with Oracle?
Does the customer perhaps not trust Oracle Support? Does the person not want to create a SR that a colleague or boss might see and question? Or does the person perhaps not have a license to use the software or feature, or is simply not sure about it?I think you're being suspicious about people again. Not everyone has some ulterior motive, and not everyone has oracle support. Many are just learning stuff for themselves and want to interact in a community of experts.
Naturally lazy, clueless or plain stupid, people are all sort of things, but many people are unnecessarily paranoid these days. Some people may prefer to withhold as much information as possible, in particular about anything to do with the Internet and computers, and often for good reasons. I find it too hard to believe that the majority of IT people posting here forgets to mention the product version because they are lazy or idjuts, or think its not important.You're entitled to your opinion. I still think you're wrong as, I feel, do many of the experts here. There's no real benefit from withholding information that is pertinent to an issue. Yes there may be the odd person who doesn't want their boss to know they are using the forum, but we don't all work in an environment where it's seen as wrong to seek help online for an every changing technology.