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      • 105. Re: Getting the splash screen a LOT today
        jgarry
        waldorfm wrote:
        It seems to me they are becoming the norm with a bullet (that's a term from radio ratings that means a song is becoming more popular). So I say no, the system is the cause.
        Would you also consider demographic factors, meaning the number of people surfing the internet without a technical background and what we consider common sense has increased?
        Well yeah, but for this thread I'm only referring to technical people that belong here. I do think there is a difference between technical fora and everything else. I could be wrong, maybe social networking will eventually jell into something that generalizes. Right now it looks more like jello to me. Sometimes tasty, but structurally unsound, even if made from components that are strong.

        >
        What about setting more incentive for people to close their posts and give feedback? I wonder if this could limit the need of people to ask for points and help to avoid spreading the "disease". I think feedback from an OP should be encouraged, and is not too much to ask for. It can also be considered a good etiquette to provide a summary and final conclusion at the end of a post, before closing. This would also help others searching for solutions.
        Way back when, that was a usenet standard, and it seemed to peter out on its own. It seems so reasonable, yet doesn't seem to have a built-in incentive.

        >
        What surprises me, although not really, is that there are repeated questions over and over again. I actually keep a document with a bunch of standard answers. I was actually wondering about putting together some sort of FAQ and redirect OP's to specific questions to find answers, but I'm not sure where to put it.
        The faq seems to be going through some kind of redesign, I would hope eventually there would be some place there. In the meantime, nothing is stopping you from posting your own, or adding to the others out there (like orafaq). Or even just pasting in each time, which you'd have to do with a link anyways. There is something authoritative about an official faq though.

        >
        I hope Billy is not upset about my reply. He actually gave me my very first star and as silly as that may sound, I was a little proud of it.
        I would guess Billy has a thick skin by now, annealed by flamage, and enjoys a reasoned debate.

        >
        Thanks for reading and feedback.
        • 106. Re: Getting the splash screen a LOT today
          jgarry
          Billy  Verreynne  wrote:
          804777 wrote:
          I don't have a problem with people being happy to have become a Guru superstar, why do you?
          I think it relevant to question the motives of why a person participates. Is it about actually helping posters with their problems.. or not? If not.. that begs the question as to what the actual motives are when the forum is specifically dedicated to assist people with their issues.
          I ran across this while looking at something completely different: http://johntropea.tumblr.com/post/1260790388/incentives-cannot-alter-the-psychological-affinity
          • 107. Re: Getting the splash screen a LOT today
            Billy~Verreynne
            804777 wrote:
            That's all fine with me, I see it the same way, but it seems to me that these bad examples are not the norm. Wouldn't it be better to address those individuals, than to question the whole system?
            Good point. But one need to ask whether the system contributes to the core focus of OTN. IMO it does not - especially as OTN worked fine without it for many years (the scoring was only introduced in 2008 I think).
            So correct me if I'm wrong, this boils down to "someone who provides correct answers and has the "right" motives too". Do you know where they sell such crystalballs?
            Not exactly. The one shows the other. The contents of a posting shows what the motivations are of the poster. For example, we've had postings about I/O performance issues. One poster would then punt solid state drives (and a specific company) and then sign off with the title of the latest book he wrote and links to his commercial website.

            How does suggesting changing existing hardware technology, assists a junior developer in understanding and analysing I/O problems? The content of such a posting clearly shows IMO the motives of the poster.

            I would vote to turn off all symbols, scores and number of postings on OTN forum - as that should never be used to determine the accuracy and correctness of a posting.
            So let's say someone with a more fancy icon get's the score because the answer is perceived as being correct. Is it generally more likely the answer is correct, yes or no?
            And that is exactly the problem I have. Before getting that ace symbol, I knew I had to show someone that his/her approach is wrong using technical argument and logic and try to convince the person to do it a better way. These days it often feels that the ace symbol carries more weight than the contents of my postings. Yes, the ace symbol is an honour. However, I want to be judged by what I write and argue - not by the scores and icons and postings I have.
            Let's say there all the fancy stuff goes away and it's just message content? How do you know which answer is correct - the one that brags the most about someones background?
            Sadly though, we've had had exactly that... A case of "+show me your CV and experiences or else you are a faker and a poser not worthy to dispense advice here on OTN+". +<sigh>+

            The right answer? In my view, there are certain ingredients in "+right answers+". Ones that want to educate. Ones that provide proof and evidence. Ones that contains sample SQL*Plus test cases that clearly demonstrates an approach/solution. Ones that contain links to documentation, references to support notes, corroborating links to blogs/whatever. The ones that explain the cause of the problem, the solution to it and why the solution works. Granted, not all answers are "+perfect+" - but more often than not, the "+right answers+" (meaningful/helpful/relevant postings are a more accurate description IMO) will have some of these characteristics.
            • 108. Re: Getting the splash screen a LOT today
              Billy~Verreynne
              jgarry wrote:

              I would guess Billy has a thick skin by now, annealed by flamage, and enjoys a reasoned debate.
              I am a survivor of The Great Flame War of '94, and have my very own flame thrower. Thick skin is mandatory. ;-)

              Having one's ideas and opinions challenged is how one expands one's ideas and opinions. It is always a valuable learning experience. So why take it personally when someone disagrees?
              I ran across this while looking at something completely different: http://johntropea.tumblr.com/post/1260790388/incentives-cannot-alter-the-psychological-affinity
              Agree strongly with that - it is my experience too participating in on-line communities. And one will be amazed at the lengths another community member will go to, to assist one...
              • 109. Re: Getting the splash screen a LOT today
                Dude!
                .... especially as OTN worked fine without it for many years (the scoring was only introduced in 2008 I think).
                Evolution is not always for the better. Removing the reward system and "status symbols" however, in my opinion, is no guarantee that the forum and its community will return to previous 2008 days. After all, the community and what it expects may have changed. I would say, when in doubt, ask. Whether or not you will make friends by improving or questioning the system is another question, because people are usually happier to get something than to have something taken away. I believe the best way to continue from here, provided that a change is really necessary, is to give people more reward options, more privileges and real benefits.
                • 110. Re: Getting the splash screen a LOT today
                  Billy~Verreynne
                  Sheez.. stop making sense! +<exasperated look>+

                  :-)
                  • 111. Re: Getting the splash screen a LOT today
                    Hoek
                    Pardon me for an ontopic intermezzo ;) :

                    I was just having the dreaded splash screen for about 3 hours the past 4 hours... +<desperate look>+
                    • 112. Re: Getting the splash screen a LOT today
                      Dude!
                      With pleasure! But just for the record, who started?
                      • 113. Re: Getting the splash screen a LOT today
                        Billy~Verreynne
                        hoek wrote:
                        Pardon me for an ontopic intermezzo ;) :

                        I was just having the dreaded splash screen for about 3 hours the past 4 hours... +<desperate look>+
                        <font color="red" size="+3">BREAK GLASS IN CASE OF OTN EMERGENCIES</font>
                        <p>
                        <font color="red" size="+1" face="Comic Sans MS">
                        <li>Do not Panic! (written in friendly Comic Sans)
                        <li>Take Deep and Slow Breaths!
                        <li>Make Sure it is an OTN Problem and not The End of the World (the latter will be announced on news.google.com)
                        <li>Have Coffee (lots of)
                        <li>Be Patient
                        <li>Wile Away the Time using Google Instant Search (type "+why is there+" in search box and have fun with the suggestions)
                        </font>
                        • 114. Re: Getting the splash screen a LOT today
                          Billy~Verreynne
                          waldorfm wrote:
                          With pleasure! But just for the record, who started?
                          Well, you may make sense, but that's not to say that I no longer want to burn down rating system here. :D
                          • 115. Re: Getting the splash screen a LOT today
                            Hoek
                            :D

                            "why is there a light in the fridge and not in the freezer"

                            That's keep me busy for a while, thanks!
                            • 116. Re: Getting the splash screen a LOT today
                              Dude!
                              Easy... perhaps it is not the best time to get too exited quite yet.
                              • 117. Re: Getting the splash screen a LOT today
                                jgarry
                                >
                                The right answer? In my view, there are certain ingredients in "+right answers+". Ones that want to educate. Ones that provide proof and evidence. Ones that contains sample SQL*Plus test cases that clearly demonstrates an approach/solution. Ones that contain links to documentation, references to support notes, corroborating links to blogs/whatever. The ones that explain the cause of the problem, the solution to it and why the solution works. Granted, not all answers are "+perfect+" - but more often than not, the "+right answers+" (meaningful/helpful/relevant postings are a more accurate description IMO) will have some of these characteristics.
                                Please someone put something like this in the faq.
                                • 118. Re: Getting the splash screen a LOT today
                                  6363
                                  SomeoneElse wrote:

                                  Performance is severely degraded today.

                                  I thought the splash screen appeared during actual downtime, but it also seems to pop up when the forums are just plain overloaded.
                                  Same behavior has been affecting the site again all day.

                                  I noticed that the forums were actually very usable and responsive during the time the stupid points feature was turned off.

                                  Given the choice between usable and responsive forums and points system of questionable utility, I vote for usable and responsive.
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