9 Replies Latest reply: Sep 20, 2012 11:40 AM by Marcel Hofstetter JomaSoft RSS

    Manage SPARC LDOMs with the OVM x86 GUI?

    Craig S. Bell
      Today I watched this recent Oracle video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MuGGZ1uLeN8

      Note the use of "Oracle VM Manager" to migrate SPARC guest domains between a T3 and T4 host (see 0:18 to 0:36).
      I'm fairly confident this is the Linux-based tool that comes with the OVM for x86 product. I don't think it's OC for OEM.

      Does anyone know whether you can use Oracle VM Manager with SPARC? I would be interested to hear more about it.
      I have never seen this before, perhaps it is an upcoming feature? Thanks in advance for any info... -cheers, CSB
        • 1. Re: Manage SPARC LDOMs with the OVM x86 GUI?
          Liam Merwick-Oracle
          You are correct in spotting that it is an Oracle VM Manager instance managing a SPARC machine - it is not a product available to customers yet but I'd hope that we can talk more about it soon.

          Currently Oracle Enterprise Manager Ops Center is the management tool for Oracle VM Server for SPARC (LDoms). http://www.oracle.com/us/products/enterprise-manager/opscenter/index.html
          • 2. Re: Manage SPARC LDOMs with the OVM x86 GUI?
            Craig S. Bell
            Thank you for the info Liam. I understand how it is with as-yet unreleased products, however Oracle did post it on YouTube for everybody to see. =-)
            We reviewed OC 12c, however the presenters (who seemed quite knowledgeable) indicated that it lacked two features which we consider necessary:

            1) Ability to manage hosts using split I/O domains (either in a fresh setup, or an imported brown-field)
            2) Ability to import a brown-field with shared storage (i.e. we are unable to migrate pre-existing guests)

            The first shortcoming is curious, as split I/O has been a feature of LDOMs since v1.0. The increased resiliency is very desirable in the enterprise.
            The second issue is odd, in that (IMHO) it should be relatively easy to manually identify backing devices across a cluster of hosts at import time.

            I will be quite interested to see if the upcoming product addresses either of these issues. Please feel free to reply when it is permissible.
            Again IMHO: Without comprehensive management, OVM for SPARC appears to lack parity with VSphere, POWER HMC, and even VirtualBox.

            I love LDOMs, but the stakeholders need to see the do-everything GUI before this wonderful technology will gain share in shops such as those.
            Please feel free to correct the record if I have gotten any of the above wrong. Thanks again... -cheers, CSB
            • 3. Re: Manage SPARC LDOMs with the OVM x86 GUI?
              Craig S. Bell
              Can anybody address the issues raised above? Are there any other available management solutions that I've missed? Thanks.
              • 4. Re: Manage SPARC LDOMs with the OVM x86 GUI?
                936381
                I agree what Craig said as well, we would need a proper GUI to handle LDOM farms.

                I noticed that same GUI in the video and something like that would be perfect for the task. Ops Center is way too slow and cumbersome to be trusted in critical operations imo, we use it as asset inventory, alerting and reporting tool only.

                For Liam(or any1 from Oracle) can you give at least a rough idea when the GUI could be expected for SPARC? This year or the next?

                - Jukka
                • 5. Re: Manage SPARC LDOMs with the OVM x86 GUI?
                  862923
                  So the $64,000 question seems to be "when will we be able to get our hands on Oracle VM Manager for LDoms?"... As some of you with keen eyes have seen, we've been showing it in demonstrations. We typically don't demonstrate things that we aren't getting pretty close with (pretty close = 6months or less). I can say that we will be releasing a "technology preview" of the Oracle VM manager in weeks, not months. This will let customers start to get their hands on it to test and evaluate. We will continue to enhance the Oracle VM Manager on SPARC leading up to a full product release with full support after the technology preview period is complete. So the tech preview will have some functional limitations, and may not be as elegant/simple to install as the full product version will be. We'll have more to say, and a pointer to how you can download very very soon.

                  JF
                  • 6. Re: Manage SPARC LDOMs with the OVM x86 GUI?
                    Craig S. Bell
                    John, thanks for the update. I look forward to seeing the preview. =-)

                    For me, the $64K question is whether the new VM Manager will manage sun4v hosts with multiple I/O domains.
                    Split I/O has been an LDOMs feature since the beginning, however Ops Center 12c cannot handle such a configuration.
                    Enterprise customers need to use multiple service domains per host, so IMHO it seems weird that this capability isn't present.

                    The $32K question: Can I import existing (brown-field) hosts and guests that are configured for live migration?
                    My understanding is that OC 12c cannot import pre-existing shared storage, and so cannot migrate guests using that.
                    Again, brown-field importation (even with a wizard or other manual assist) should IMHO be a fundamental enterprise feature.

                    Any thoughts on those two capabilities? Thx. -cheers, CSB
                    • 7. Re: Manage SPARC LDOMs with the OVM x86 GUI?
                      862923
                      Craig, I prefer the easier $2k questions ;-)

                      Supporting split-bus (multiple IO domain) configurations is vital. We agree that all of our serious datacenter customers use that as a best practice. As you've noted, OpsCenter has thus far not supported those configurations well, but that is being addressed as a top priority. One of the challenges we have with the Oracle VM Manager is its origin as a management entity for Xen deployments on x86, where there is a notion of a single "dom0". We are having to teach OVM Manager about LDoms control infrastructure (control domain, multiple IO domains etc.) - it is one of a dozen really important things that we are working madly on.

                      Brownfield is also in that dozen really important things - OVM manager has a leg up as it already has some brownfield support now; we expect even in the technology preview for SPARC that Oracle VM manager can discover LDoms already on your SPARC systems; the degree to which you can then actively manage those domains through the manager will be explained at time of release. There is a requirement to add some management agent bits to your existing server, and that your control domain is running S11. Best thing customers can do now is start moving their control domains and IO service domains to S11 in preparation not just of the Oracle VM Manager (and in general better management capabilities), but also for new advanced feature support. You can keep your application domains running S10.
                      • 8. Re: Manage SPARC LDOMs with the OVM x86 GUI?
                        Craig S. Bell
                        John, thank you for the detailed response, and for the advice about updating non-guests to 5.11.
                        I look forward to seeing more about the new VM Manager. -cheers, CSB
                        • 9. Re: Manage SPARC LDOMs with the OVM x86 GUI?
                          Marcel Hofstetter JomaSoft
                          Hi Craig
                          ... will manage sun4v hosts with multiple I/O domains ...
                          I vote for KISS "keep it simple ..." and only one control and I/O domain.
                          As we all know Solaris is very stable. The only downtime of the control domain should be
                          when patching or for hardware/fw maintenance. With LDOM 2.2 just migrate the
                          guests live to another hardware, then you have time for maintenance.

                          Best regards,
                          Marcel Hofstetter
                          JomaSoft

                          Edited by: Marcel Hofstetter JomaSoft on 20.09.2012 09:40