1 2 Previous Next 23 Replies Latest reply: Aug 10, 2013 6:29 AM by Cvele_new_account RSS

    My experience with 12c


      Hello community.


      We were all very excited to get the new 12c and we were looking forward with great longing for the new version. So, we must definitely congratulate Oracle and the jDev team that worked so hard in order to pull this out.


      From the very first date of the release until now, we keep developing in the brand new 12c and we have spotted some issues that we would like to mention, in case they remain unspotted. Just to share them with you and get probably an opinion or workaround.


      1)      When we create ViewCriteria we have no control over the check boxes “Ignore Case” and “Ignore Null Values” because both of them are dimmed out (!).

      Also, if a bind variable is included in the VC, then the corresponding ViewCriteriaItem will also get automatically the property GenerateIsNullClauseForBindVars="false", although the default value is true! We have to explicitly set to true in the XML file (and not <default>( true)) in order the VC to operate as it used to be.

      2)      We have followed the recommended approach of having one root AM and all the rest nested under the root. But when we drag and drop a VO inside a page, the iterator created has the “Binds” property set like this:

      Binds="FatherAMDataControl.dataProvider.ChildAM.MyTestVO", instead of

      Binds="Root.ChildAM.MyTestVO"                                             causing runtime error.

      Manually correcting the property in the XML file, has the side effect jDev to create new iterator (again with wrong Binds property) every time we create a new attribute/tree binding in the page.

      3)      Again having nested AM, the detail iterator of a master-detail does not point (visually with an arrow) to the corresponding VO in the Bindings.

      4)      In the bindings tab of a page with a region, activation property cannot be set to “<default>Immediate” value. By default the activation is set to “deferred”.

      5)      Variables inside bindings cannot be set and cannot be used. Please read previous post here https://forums.oracle.com/thread/2562706

      6)      In general we were expecting a better or even the same IDE performance with the previous jDev 11g R2. Unfortunately, although we have applied the exact same settings with the previous jDev, IDE turns to be slow even when writing java code (type and wait some second(s) to see what we’ve typed). We have unchecked the “Build Changed Projects After Save” as it was causing even worse performance.

      7)      af:table (with filterable attribute) which stems from query based VOs does not show the filters. Please read here https://forums.oracle.com/thread/2567156

      8)      dvt pie chart has to be manually refreshed in order to be presented in the right size. At first it shows up too big to fit to the facet and after refreshing it's been redrawn to the right size.


      We totally understand the magnitude and the significance of the effort for the 12c with the spectacular new features, but we will also appreciate any workaround or fix of the above mentioned issues.


      Best Regards,



      Message was edited by: apostolosk just added points 7 and 8

        • 1. Re: My experience with 12c
          Chris Muir-Oracle

          Thanks for posting your concerns, I'll attempt to answer here.


          1) Regarding "Ignore case", as per the help page "This option is enabled for Strings only".  I wont lodge a bug on this.


          Regarding "Ignore Null Values" as per the help page "This option is only enabled when Validation is set to Optional and the attribute value is supplied by a required bind parameter (those defined for use in a query WHERE clause)".  In order to test this, create a bind variable on the VO query page, then in the ViewCriteria editor you can map to this new bind variable.  At that point the "Ignore Null Values" checkbox becomes available.


          Regarding "GenerateIsNullClauseForBindVars="false"" can you confirm the runtime behaviour is also wrong?


          2) Existing bug 17252882

          3) I suspect this will be a side effect of #2 bug 17252882

          4) Raised new bug 17280202

          5) Raised new bugs 17279986 and 17280063 as per ADF EMG issues

          6) As speed is often a subjective concern and can be due to things like hardware and virus scanners, this is a hard one for me to diagnose.  I'm going to refer this concern to the IDE product manager and leave it to his discretion to follow up.

          7) Raised new bug 17279781 as per ADF EMG issue

          8) Can I have a sample test case and steps to reproduce.  Suggest you raise a separate OTN forum post and link to this one.


          In regards to all bugs, note they are lodged but don't necessarily get priority from development.  If the issues are critical to you, you need to raise a Support Request with Oracle Support such that development will be directed to give correct priority for an actual customer.



          • 2. Re: My experience with 12c

            Because of all this, we will wait for the next two bugfix releases, before we start the next project under 12c :-)

            • 3. Re: My experience with 12c
              Chris Muir-Oracle

              Why? At this stage most of these bugs are fairly minor in the scheme of things.  Which of these bugs is a blocker?



              • 4. Re: My experience with 12c

                Hi Chris.


                First of all, thank you very much for your time to reply to every single point to this post.

                Your reply to points 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 is crystal clear and there’s nothing more to say.

                Although about point 6 (IDE performance) just to add that I run 12c with the same h/w and settings as with 11g R2 (and the difference is big!).


                For point 8 I followed your suggestion, so you may check here: https://forums.oracle.com/message/11138099


                For point 1 about VC, I’d like to just quickly reply with an example. I have countriesVO and create a VC with two bind variables. GenerateIsNullClauseForBindVars="false" is automatically created for every ViewCriteriaItem.

                In a form I have countries table and a query panel with the specific VC.

                OK, in 12c when I click “search” with no criteria, the query that actually runs in the background is the following:


                SELECT CountriesEO.COUNTRY_ID, CountriesEO.COUNTRY_NAME, CountriesEO.REGION_ID

                  FROM COUNTRIES CountriesEO

                WHERE ( ( (UPPER (CountriesEO.COUNTRY_ID) = UPPER (:bvCountryId))

                          AND (CountriesEO.REGION_ID = :bvRegionId)))


                and that will yield no result because of where clause! I cannot say “it’s wrong” but I can say it’s not the expected behavior (since everything was declaratively created).


                Alright, if I set GenerateIsNullClauseForBindVars="true" and not <default>( true) (because the last one will be converted to false), the query in the background looks like this now (click search with no criteria again):


                SELECT CountriesEO.COUNTRY_ID, CountriesEO.COUNTRY_NAME, CountriesEO.REGION_ID

                FROM COUNTRIES CountriesEO


                and this will yield the expected results.

                Best Regards


                • 5. Re: My experience with 12c
                  Chris Muir-Oracle

                  On 6, can you state your environment please, so that's:


                  a) Your specific JDev version (I know I know, it's the only 12c build, but for posterity)

                  b) Your windows version (I'm assuming it's windows?)

                  c) Your JDK version

                  d) And if you have any virusscanners running, what are they, what version, and do you have any exemptions in place

                  e) Your hardware, specifically chip (i5 vs i7), cores, memory, HD or SSD, if HD then also RPM


                  Assuming the IDE PM does check in this information will help him.  Personally I haven't seen any difference on the same architecture, but I use a Mac so I can't double check this.


                  On point 1 and 8 I'll check tomorrow morning as it's the end of my day (unless someone else checks in before then), thanks for raising the separate post for 8.



                  • 6. Re: My experience with 12c
                    Timo Hahn

                    Let me step in here for point 6.

                    As you don't give specifics about your environment we can't comment. I run 11g and 12c on the same hardware and don't see any such issues.

                    My speck is Win7x64, JDK1.7.0_25 64Bit, 16GB memory.


                    Point 1:

                    I too would this call a bug.

                    I can't even find the 'required' checkbox for a bind variable in the UI if they are only used in a VC (this is said in the help!). This is a change from the 11g behavior where bind variables used in VC could be ignored or set to required.  I do have the feeling that there is something missing here.



                    • 7. Re: My experience with 12c

                      OK Chris, my specifications for point 6:


                      a) JDev version:

                      b) OS: Win7x64

                      c) JDK version: JDK1.7.0_25 64Bit

                      d) Antivirus: MS Forefront with no exceptions set, but I stop the service sometimes (yes I take the risk) and performance improves a little bit.

                      e) My hardware: Intel Core i5 @3.20GHz, 4 cores, 6GB memory, 512GB HD (cannot provide RPM right now).


                      Timo you have 16GB memory?! Probably that's why you don't see any difference between 11g and 12c...


                      Best Regards


                      • 8. Re: My experience with 12c

                        Timo and Chris,


                        considering the performance issue just to add that apart from the h/w and other specs, another factor that plays major role is the size of the application itself. In small HR projects 11g and 12c behave the same and it's hard to notice any diff there. In our case, the ADF application uses jars of almost 40mb containing around 400 VOs, not to mention the number of pages, pageDef, btf, menus, java files etc...

                        So, please consider also this factor.




                        • 9. Re: My experience with 12c
                          Chris Muir-Oracle

                          In this regards it is subjective as it depends on your source code.  You'll understand from Oracle's perspective we have internal teams with 1000 of artefacts per workspace and are continuing to work, so it must be something relevant to your situation that is causing issue.  We'd like to investigate why and provide assistance where we can.


                          Having spoken to our IDE PM this morning, can you please lodge an SR on the speed issue, and:


                          a) Submit your source code so we can analyze your specific code

                          b) Give us specific metrics on actions under 11g vs 12c

                          c) Mention my name so the support analyst will contact me

                          d) Also post the SR here


                          *Obviously for "a" you/your organization needs to be comfortable to supply Oracle Support your source code.  Typically there is an NDA and privacy agreement between each organization as part of the Oracle Support contract, but you need to make your own call are you happy to do this*


                          Assuming you go ahead we'll attempt to look into the issue for you.



                          • 10. Re: My experience with 12c
                            Chris Muir-Oracle

                            On Point 1 and following up from Timo's post, I'm not sure if the intention is now you should include a separate predicate in your where clause yourself to cater for the null.  I'll need to follow this up internally to understand where we were going with this.



                            • 11. Re: My experience with 12c

                              Chris thanks again a lot for your reply and suggestions.


                              Unfortunately our company here has a very rigid privacy policy and thus, we cannot provide you with the source code

                              The run time response of our application is very satisfactory in 12c, but the IDE performs very poorly. What I want to imply here is that probably it's not a matter of source code anyway...

                              I will appreciate any tip concerning the IDE performance.



                              Best Regards,


                              • 12. Re: My experience with 12c

                                Can you please compare 12c app perfomance vs 11 g (R1) for example ?

                                This is most significant for us.


                                • 13. Re: My experience with 12c

                                  The application performance in 12c looks better than 11g !

                                  • 14. Re: My experience with 12c
                                    Timo Hahn

                                    Point 1) ViewCriteria again:

                                    I check this out again. I dod not get the wrong queries you get. However, the results are worse moving this point ofer to the ADF EMG issue tracker (https://java.net/jira/browse/ADFEMG-159) where we all can see and work on the same sources.



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