1 2 3 Previous Next 34 Replies Latest reply: Apr 5, 2014 5:42 AM by Marwim RSS

    Product related questions

    Catch_22

      I think I mentioned it before, but why bother to tell people that they are not supposed to post a product related questions here. People do it either knowingly on purpose, or by mistake. In both cases, I think removing such posts on sight is the best education and there is no need to provide a notice.

        • 1. Re: Product related questions
          BluShadow

          No, because if they're "newbies" and we just remove the posts, they may think that there's been some problem and just post another again in the same forum.

          At least if we tell them they're posting in the wrong forum and leave that post there for a while (removing it after, say, 24 hrs) then at least they have a chance to read that response, learn they need to be more careful where they're posting and hopefully consider where to post better in all their future posts.

           

          If they do it knowingly, then they're stupid.

          If they do it by mistake, we can at least point out their mistake to them.

          Just deleting the post will only cause them confusion, not educate them.

          • 2. Re: Product related questions
            Catch_22

            I understand, but I also think that newbie or not and what a newbie may think or not doesn't really matter. I don't think that anyone, including a newbie, can possibly be so blind not to see the note about product related questions. If a product related post gets removed here it is quite obvious why. Of course, if someone does it again and again, they can say "oh, I did not know".  But maybe it should rather be addressed when that happens.

            • 3. Re: Product related questions
              gimbal2

              I assume the question gets posted in the wrong subforum because it is the one where they landed through a search engine and not because there was a thought process behind it. Even if I'm not correct, I'm still sure it is the product of carelessness. The question then becomes: should the careless be punished by having their otherwise relevant question be locked or even removed, or helped by having it moved?

              • 4. Re: Product related questions
                Catch_22

                I don't know how people landed here and to be honest, I don't think it matters. It clearly outlines not to post any product related question when creating a post here. It is unmistakably and very difficult not to realize. It maybe carelessness, ignorance, provoking, mistake, laziness or simply a try, but I see no reason why any of that should interfere and bother everyone more than necessary. It is not about punishment or whether a post is a technical question or not. This is just a forum and not a hospital. But be it as it may, I can live with the current situation and just wanted to point it out.

                • 5. Re: Product related questions
                  BluShadow

                  Dude! wrote:

                   

                  I understand, but I also think that newbie or not and what a newbie may think or not doesn't really matter. I don't think that anyone, including a newbie, can possibly be so blind not to see the note about product related questions. If a product related post gets removed here it is quite obvious why. Of course, if someone does it again and again, they can say "oh, I did not know".  But maybe it should rather be addressed when that happens.

                   

                  Well...

                   

                  a) English isn't everyone's first language, as you're well aware, so understanding the forum heading isn't always going to be easy for everyone.

                  b) The first part of the forum title is "Community Feedback and Suggestions"... so people may be thinking "Well, I need 'suggestions' for my issue, so it must be the right place"

                  c) If a person posts something and it's removed I don't think it's that obvious to them. I think they're more likely to think "Where's my post gone?" and just post it again... taking up more resources... and so on.

                  d) When a person has been told they shouldn't post here, it's rare to see that same person posting here again with another product question.

                  e) If it's obvious where the post belongs, the moderators may even find time to move it to the correct place and then inform them they posted in the wrong place... We're nice like that. 

                  • 6. Re: Product related questions
                    gimbal2

                    BluShadow wrote:

                    e) We're nice like that. 

                    Lies, all moderators are evil by extension. It comes with the job.

                    • 7. Re: Product related questions
                      Catch_22

                      Sure, language can be an issue, but then again why should they understand a response not to post any product related question if they do not understand the forum header. It think this is a bit too far fetched.

                       

                      There may be several reason why people post product related questions here, but if I associate possible reasons with my forum experience, then I conclude that most people must do so because of ignorance, laziness or because they have an urgent problem and no time or clue how to address the issue. I understand your desire to be nice to everyone, please don't get me wrong, but I think it should also be addressed to the right people and for the right reasons.

                       

                      If a user posts a message again and again, meaning they are challenging the system or do not understand the forum header, then there is still a chance to tell people when this occurs. The question might be how many people will actually attempt to re-post their message after it was simply removed. My gut feeling tells me it would be less than 20 % because the majority of people are well aware not to post product related questions here. And I don't think those 20 % deserve a treatment at the cost of all others. The may rather deserve a special treatment.

                      • 8. Re: Product related questions
                        BluShadow

                        There may be several reason why people post product related questions here, but if I associate possible reasons with my forum experience, then I conclude that most people must do so because of ignorance, laziness or because they have an urgent problem and no time or clue how to address the issue. I understand your desire to be nice to everyone, please don't get me wrong, but I think it should also be addressed to the right people and for the right reasons.

                         

                        I would actually conclude that most post here by accident (so yes, out of ignorance).  They've joined up to a forum they're not familiar with, they don't know how to get around, or how the forum spaces are laid out so when they land on the Home Page (English) the look down the screen and the first thing they see is this at the top...

                         

                        Technology Network Community

                        •Community Feedback and Suggestions

                        •Downloads Issues

                        •Documentation

                        •Certification

                        •...more

                         

                        ... then they say to themselves... "well it's not a download issue, and I don't want documentation or certification, so it must be this "Community Feedback and Suggestions" forum I need"... and look... it doesn't state on that title that there shouldn't be product related questions posted there.... and who really ever bothers to click on "... more" unless they really can't see what they want.

                         

                        Let's face it, the layout of the forums doesn't make it easy for people to find the correct forum..... I've been here years, and even I struggle to find the correct forums sometimes if I want to move someone's post, and I'm just trying to look for it from the Home page.

                         

                        I don't see any justification for just deleting the posts without some sort of warning or helping hand to guide them that they should have posted elsewhere.

                        • 9. Re: Product related questions
                          Hemant K Chitale

                          I agree.  I believe that most newbies don't know how to "navigate" through this site and identify the correct forum / "space" to post in.  Also, they don't immediately understand the meaning of the title of this "default / first" "space".  It is right of the moderator to add a polite response asking the OP to look for the right forum / "space" and repost.

                           

                          Hemant K Chitale

                          • 10. Re: Product related questions
                            Catch_22

                            It always amazes me how people are able to read other peoples intentions and mind. But why bother? I'm not trying to analyze why people post product related questions here, and I see no reason to teach people not to post to a forum, which clearly states not to post product related questions. To say that people post in the feedback forum because they are not able to find a more appropriate forum space, well, I suggest not to be fooled. 

                             

                            The number of invalid postings is not so bad that it makes using the forum a real problem, but I find the displaying of these messages, including the nice attempts to tell the people not do do so, and in particular the green postings (mentions), rather unnecessary.

                             

                            I would rather suggest a different way to manage the situation. If the majority of invalid postings here in this forum is by mistake or ignorance, then I think it can be assumed that these people are resilient to criticism or do not need to be educated. I suggest to simply remove those posts and deal with the matter only if someone continues to post.

                            • 11. Re: Product related questions
                              Marwim

                              I would not bark at someone who is new in town when he knocks on my door because he is lost. Instead I would try to show him the correct way. Anything else would be rude. When he comes back day after day and asks me, then I will sooner or later become indignant and shut the door.

                               

                              So instead of simply deleting the first wrong post I consider it better to keep the current behaviour to lock the first posting with a comment why it is done.

                               

                              Regards

                              Marcus

                              • 12. Re: Product related questions
                                Catch_22

                                Yes, that all nice and dandy so to say,  but do you really believe the majority of invalid posts here is because people are lost?

                                 

                                With all due to respect and understanding for people who are indeed lost. And btw, if they were lost, they would rather ask where to post their question,  since when do the poster who do not comply to rules have the right to penetrate the forum?

                                • 13. Re: Product related questions
                                  gimbal2

                                  Dude! wrote:

                                   

                                  Yes, that all nice and dandy so to say,  but do you really believe the majority of invalid posts here is because people are lost?

                                   

                                  Yes, I do believe it is only a minority which willingly and knowingly break the rules. Why? Because of BluShadow's point:

                                   

                                  d) When a person has been told they shouldn't post here, it's rare to see that same person posting here again with another product question.

                                   

                                  That's simply true, people don't often repeat-offend. There -is- more going on than you want to believe, apparently the usage of forums is not as clear-cut to plenty of people as it is to you and me. Lets get over it and just suffer the minor consequences, its still the moderators who have the most work there. I don't see them complaining.

                                  • 14. Re: Product related questions
                                    Marwim

                                    I don't care whether they are lost or ignorant. The first time you knock on my door I will not ask why you don't knock on another door. Try it out - next time you come to LA/Bavaria look for a pink house and knock :-)

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