8 Replies Latest reply on Jun 16, 2014 10:26 PM by Avi Miller-Oracle

    Oracle Linux Containers, KVM, and XEN Support Question?

    Rucadulu2

      Does Oracle Support its products (DB's, APPS, etc.) running on Oracle Linux Containers ?

       

      I understand Oracle Supports running KVM and XEN hypervisors on Oracle Linux and that it does NOT support Oracle DB's, APPS, etc. running in a guest OS running on KVM or XEN on a Oracle linux host.  However, does Oracle support running Oracle Linux Guests in KVM or XEN on an Oracle Linux Host ?

       

      I am curious as to why Oracle will Support it DB's APPS etc. in OracleVM which is an Oracle custom XEN hypervisor but not in the Standard XEN hypervisor that comes with Oracle Linux? Is there really that much different between the two products outside of the GUI interfaces used to manage each?

       

      Also what is Oracle's Support policies for running Oracle Linux, DB's APPS, etc. in Oracle VirtualBox ?

        • 1. Re: Oracle Linux Containers, KVM, and XEN Support Question?
          Dude!

          As far as I know, the only officially supported virtualization platform for running Oracle database products under Linux is Oracle VM Server for x86 which is based on XEN.

           

          You may find the following info useful: Virtualization Matrix

           

          I'm not sure, but I think I read somewhere, perhaps the release notes that Oracle Linux 6.5 added support for MS Hyper-V.

          1 person found this helpful
          • 2. Re: Oracle Linux Containers, KVM, and XEN Support Question?
            Avi Miller-Oracle

            There is a difference between support and certify: we will support you running Oracle products wherever you like, but  we may ask you to recreate any issues on a certified stack (either bare-metal or a certified hypervisor). Also, we have done no testing of the Oracle stack in any other virtualisation stack.

             

            Currently, we certify Oracle products running on Oracle Linux on Oracle VM (as this is fully tested), as well as Oracle products running on Microsoft Windows on Hyper-V. There are also some products that are certified on Oracle Linux on Hyper-V. You need to check the certification matrix for the specific product and the My Oracle Support articles about virtualisation support.

             

            As for why we only support Oracle products on Oracle VM and not Xen that ships with Oracle Linux: it's because only Oracle Linux has Xen and it's very, very old. Too old for us. The Xen in Oracle VM is much newer. We also do a lot of work around the Xen capabilities in Oracle VM.

             

            Finally, the support for Oracle products in VirtualBox is the same as my first point: supported, not certified. Highly recommended for development environments, though. We even ship a bunch of pre-built VirtualBox appliances for developers that have pre-installed versions of things like Database, Fusion Middleware, Enterprise Manager, etc.

            • 3. Re: Oracle Linux Containers, KVM, and XEN Support Question?
              Rucadulu2

              Avi MIller, and Dude! Thank you both very much for the information.  Do either of you know if there is any chance that Oracle may move forward with getting Oracle DB's, APPS, etc ceritified on Oracle Linux Containers and the XEN version include in Oracle Linux.
              I was asking because I can see the potential for using Oracle Linux Containers and the older XEN that comes with Oracle Linux on older 32 bit and 64bit CPU's that do not support Hardware Virtualization. At the Moment the only Option I see for these older CPU's is to use the older Oracle VM 2.x which ends preimer support next year (11/2015) And for me personnal after having used Oracle VM 2.2 in the past I do not want to go back to Oracle VM 2.2 at all as Oracle VM 3.2 is so much better. And when you comapre the management GUI of Oracle VM 2.2 with the one for that comes in Oracle Linux for the included XEN product I am sorry to say that the Oracle VM 2.2 GUI is just not as good.

               

              Thank you, Russell (rucadulu)

              • 4. Re: Oracle Linux Containers, KVM, and XEN Support Question?
                Avi Miller-Oracle

                Rucadulu2 wrote:

                 

                Avi MIller, and Dude! Thank you both very much for the information.  Do either of you know if there is any chance that Oracle may move forward with getting Oracle DB's, APPS, etc ceritified on Oracle Linux Containers and the XEN version include in Oracle Linux.

                 

                I can foresee the product teams possibly doing certification on Linux Containers (LXC) and Docker, but almost certainly not the very old version of Xen in Oracle Linux 5. Note that Oracle Linux 5 is almost out of support already and Oracle Linux 6 doesn't include Xen support. Further, it's almost impossible to buy hardware now that isn't 64-bit and doesn't support the hardware virtualisation extensions required by Oracle VM 3.2. If you have such old hardware that can't run Oracle VM 3, you probably shouldn't have it in production anyway (and should look at something like Oracle VM VirtualBox).

                • 5. Re: Oracle Linux Containers, KVM, and XEN Support Question?
                  Dude!

                  In addition, you cannot run a 64-bit guest OS under VirtualBox, or any Type-2 virtualization software for that matter, without support for hardware assisted virtualization (vt-x/amd-v).

                   

                  But why would anyone still bother with a 32-bit platform? The 32-bit address space limitations are no longer reasonable or feasible for most modern installations. Even the 32-bit CPU's are no longer adequate or supported.

                   

                  Xen is a dead horse. RHEL 6 dropped support for Xen in favor of KVM, which Red Hat acquired in 2008.

                  • 6. Re: Oracle Linux Containers, KVM, and XEN Support Question?
                    Avi Miller-Oracle

                    Dude! wrote:

                     

                    Xen is a dead horse. RHEL 6 dropped support for Xen in favor of KVM, which Red Hat acquired in 2008.

                     

                    Xen is very, very far from a dead horse: it's in mainline and is the basis for Oracle VM. Red Hat dropped support for Xen because they bought Quramnet, the developers of KVM. Note that Oracle are on the Xen Advisory Council and the mainline Xen manager works in our kernel development team. Just because Red Hat dropped it, doesn't mean it's dead at all.

                    • 7. Re: Oracle Linux Containers, KVM, and XEN Support Question?
                      Rucadulu2

                      Avi Miller, thank you for your input in regards to Linux Containers. For the record I never said whether I using the old 32bit and 64bit CPU's in a production environment or not. I do us them for testing and at our DR site for emergency servers to fail over too. At our shop we run a server until it quits for good, we do not like to just go out and by new just because we can.  We have several pieces of hardware that are still in some for of production use that are 8 to 10 yrs old. We even have an SYS987 HP 3000 Main frame that is still up and running in production and it is more the 30 years old.  There are lots of reasons to use old hardware. Keep in mind that there those of us that have to use it because, we have been give few options by upper management.

                       

                      As far as the XEN Dead horse thing I think Oracle VM Server and Citrix XEN Server will keep it alive with or without Red Hat using it.

                       

                      As for KVM no one has really discussed if Oracle has any certification plans for KVM that is included with Oracle Linux 5.x , 6.x, and 7.x .

                      • 8. Re: Oracle Linux Containers, KVM, and XEN Support Question?
                        Avi Miller-Oracle

                        Rucadulu2 wrote:

                         

                        As for KVM no one has really discussed if Oracle has any certification plans for KVM that is included with Oracle Linux 5.x , 6.x, and 7.x .

                         

                        There are currently no plans to certify Oracle products (as far as I know) under KVM. Note that Oracle product certification is product-specific, so the Linux team have very little control over the certification platforms done by RDBMS, for example. If you want a particular stack certified for a particular product, you will need to take it up with that product's management team, via Oracle SR.