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      • 45. Re: Hands On Course Requirement
        311441
        People don't want a book on index internals, per se,
        they want a book on "Optimizing Oracle Indexes", a
        useful book that answers important questions:

        - When do I use bitmap indexes?
        - How many distinct values is too many for a bitmap
        index?
        - How do I tell when an index will benefit from
        rebuilding?
        - How do I find un-used indexes?
        - How to I remove redundant multi-column indexes
        - &c, &c . . .
        Hi Don

        Where did I say it was a book on index internals ????

        It of course covers all those topics plus Domain Indexes, Spatial Indexes, Clustered Segments, IOTs and IOT Secondary indexes, Partitioned Indexes, CBO internals and Indexes, Constraints management, etc. etc.

        And how multiblock sized indexes is a generally a very dumb idea ...

        However, you're absolutely correct that it won't be published, can I take a share in your winnings :)

        There you go, we agree yet again :)

        Cheers

        Richard Foote
        http://richardfoote.wordpress.com/
        • 46. Re: Hands On Course Requirement
          108476
          Where did I say it was a book on index internals
          You wrote "I've almost finished my Oracle Indexing book"

          OK, I'll bite. What's the working title?
          how multiblock sized indexes is a generally a very dumb idea
          Ah, just what we need, another myth-maker.

          The benefits are well-documented, even in the Oracle docs:

          http://www.dba-oracle.com/t_multiple_blocksizes_summary.htm
          you're absolutely correct that it won't be published
          Why would anybody write a book, and not submit it? You should at least try . . . .

          http://www.oreilly.com/oreilly/author/intro.csp

          http://www.mcgraw-hill.com.sg/author/index.jsp

          Remember, NEVER approach multiple publishers at the same time. Pick your fav, submit a proposal, and only contact another if it's been rejected.

          If you want to chat, e-mail me. Let's not hijack this thread . . .
          • 47. Re: Hands On Course Requirement
            108476
            Hi Richard,

            Could it be that different countries have differet hands-on course criteria?

            This is very disturbing:

            Francisco notes that Oracle accepted any course not taught by an OCP, waiving their previous requirement for a hands-on course at Oracle University”

            “I'm a Oracle OCP.OCE. I give internal training to several DBAs, and when asked by Oracle about the "hands on course requirement" they told Oracle that the course (in this case Oracle 10g DBA I, II, and Tuning) was given by a Oracle Certified professional, and Oracle accepted it.

            I had more than 15 DBA at Sonda Chile certified at OCA, and 6 OCP, OCE.”
            • 48. Re: Hands On Course Requirement
              311441
              how multiblock sized indexes is a generally a very
              dumb idea

              Ah, just what we need, another myth-maker.

              The benefits are well-documented, even in the Oracle
              docs:
              Hi Don

              Where in the Oracle docs ? A pointer to the Oracle docs rather than your article would be a nice start ...

              Interestingly you've gone from:

              "One of the very first things the Oracle 9i database administrator should do is to migrate all of their Oracle indexes into a large blocksize tablespace. Indexes will always favor the largest supported blocksize" in this article:

              http://www.dba-oracle.com/art_dbazine_9i_multiblock.htm

              to:

              "For most databases, creating multiple blocksizes is not going to make a measurable difference, and the deployment of multiple blocksizes must be carefully evaluated on a case-by-case basis." in this article:

              http://www.dba-oracle.com/t_multiple_blocksizes_summary.htm#dba

              So credit to you Don, you're getting there. I almost, just about agree with your last statement except it doesn't mention how performance can actually worsen in many databases.
              Why would anybody write a book, and not submit it?
              You should at least try . . . .
              Similar reasons to why I write the Blog, or why I draw or why I play sport.

              It's not all in the name of fame and fortune ...

              Cheers

              Richard Foote
              http://richardfoote.wordpress.com/
              • 49. My thoughts on OCP
                oraclemagician
                I agree with Don and Richard on this one!

                To me, real world experience trumps a
                certification with the exception of a candidate with experience and the OCM certification.

                I have worked with paper DBAs who were dangerous and trashed production databases that I had to fix in the middle of the night.

                I am only working on my OCP just to keep the recruiter and human resource gate keepers happy that I actually know Oracle when I apply for new contracts. With that said, study is much easier now that I have years of experience as an Oracle DBA so I only need to review the more esoteric topics of the OCP.

                As for writing a book- it is a lot of hard work but one of the most rewarding things that I will have ever done in my professional career. I have learned so much about topics that are poorly documented or unknown. Once I complete my first book on Oracle Database Migrations than it will be fun and a great challenge to research and write more.

                Cheers,
                Ben Prusinski
                Oracle DBA Consultant
                http://oracle-magician.blogspot.com/
                • 50. Re: My thoughts on OCP
                  639907
                  Hi,

                  I agree with you guys (Dear Burleson, is a honor cross some words with you, I also lived 5 years in NC) regarding the quality of some DBAs and Oracle University Instructors. I was a Oracle Instructor for Oracle Brazil, and Oracle Chile. I worked on the first team to introduce oracle (oracle 7 beta) on South America (Brazil project on 1989). Burleson is correct to say that Oracle University Instructors only know what is on the ppts only, and if you ask something else they panic. On my 10g DBA I training my instructor was telling the people if they had performance problems they need delete the statistics of whole database and recreate it on any time. I saw many students panic next day because the panic they created on their jobs doing this on a production environment at top hours.

                  I was told from Oracle the same that Burleson said, only official training on Oracle University. I told my guys to try, when connect to prometric page to request the Hands on approval, they wrote that received the training from a OPN member and the instructor was a OCP, then 48 hours later all got their Hands on approved, without any further question.

                  I hope this help some people to move on with the OCP, because the cost and the quality of the course on Oracle University are very poor.

                  I found my self on Chile, and now on New Zealand with a serious problem to found real DBAs, because they have many DBAS with only knowledge on create users, extend tablespaces, create objects, export, import, etc. For me they are not DBAs they are DBOs (Data Base Operators), with not knowledge regarding how Oracle works internally (memory and process), no knowledge on tuning. I found several big companies with data Warehouse with 8k blocks size, OLTP Databases with a 3 GB SGA (200 MB Block buffer and 2.8 Shared Pool area), Very Oltp Database with log buffers of 128 kb and 5 group of redo log files of 10 MB each having a average of 300 log switches per hour...and a lot of crazy situations.

                  It's very hard to measure a Oracle DBA experience. Only a real hand on (live) test I think will be a solution to this problem.

                  Regards,

                  Francisco Alvarez
                  • 51. Re: Hands On Course Requirement
                    108476
                    Hi Richard,
                    Interestingly you've gone from:
                    Yeah, I try to keep an open mind, I changed the page.
                    how performance can actually worsen in many databases.
                    Ah, so you agree, different index blocksizes do have a profound impact on performance? I knew you would come-around!
                    why I play sport.
                    Lemme guess, cricket?

                    Me, I play golf, but I suck, big time:

                    http://www.dba-oracle.com/consultant_golf_etiquette.htm
                    Why would anybody write a book, and not submit it?
                    Nah, I don't buy it. I think you are pulling my leg. . . .
                    • 52. Re: My thoughts on OCP
                      108476
                      Hi Francisco,
                      I also lived 5 years in NC
                      Oh, cool. Did the redneck lifestyle rub off on you?

                      http://www.dba-oracle.com/redneck.htm
                      I told my guys to try, when connect to prometric page to request the Hands on approval, they wrote that received the training from a OPN member and the instructor was a OCP, then 48 hours later all got their Hands on approved, without any further question.
                      Wow, that's a GREAT tip! It could save people thousands of dollars . . . .
                      Oracle University Instructors only know what is on the ppts only, and if you ask something else they panic.
                      I had an OU instructor approach me years ago and say "So, what's it like to be a working DBA?"
                      • 53. Re: My thoughts on OCP
                        639907
                        Hi Burleson,

                        Thank for the link, it's excellent.
                        I am a Redneck at heart....I loved this life style. Also I meet several good people when I was a Paramedic, member of a Rescue Squad there.

                        (Again, is a honor for me be chating with you)

                        Regards,

                        Francisco Munoz Alvarez
                        • 54. Re: My thoughts on OCP
                          Madrid
                          Whatch out Paco Munoz, you have not taken a course with me ;), generalizing is not a good practice since the great lies come from generalized paradigms.

                          I have been working with the Oracle database since release 5.0 was being migrated to 6.0 and starting with 7.3 I began to work as an Oracle Instructor. I still do teaching for Oracle University today, and I DO know much more than what is being written on the manual, I DO NOT panic when I have to face real life questions that go far beyond what is being written on the books.

                          I have worked to balance both activities, the training and the consulting, I get practical knowledge from the industry, this allows me to better bring practical scenarios to the classroom, and I take the knowlege on HowTo more effectively and efficiently perform the day by day oracle DBA activity.

                          It is not the point to assess what does it feel to be a DBA, but what does it feel to be a real professional DBA who is able to go to the real life scenarios and feedback the experience to the classroom, then take the HowTo's from the books and research and bring this knowlege to better do the day by day tasks.

                          I can say I have seen several 'consultants' who still do the traditional export/import to 'defragment' their database and look for 'better performance' with the one extent technique so it their database don't get fragmented LOL. And people who still do the job the way their parent DBA's told them to do without questioning. I have seen several crafts of dba's still debating on when to open a maintenance window because the term MAA doesn't mean any thing to them.

                          Since I first started teaching the NFA -new features for administrators- semminars (8.0, 8i, 9i, 10g, 11g) I realize how the 'consultant' community lacks of knowledge and because of this, they missuse a 9i, 10g or 11g as if it was a 7.3 or 8.0. Several times, in order for me to expose an 11g new feature I have to make some background history so people understands what I am talking about, people who were good consultants and they thought they could be still called senior dba's just because that's what it says in their business cards, but without realizing they become obsolete as time goes by. So is it correct to say that the whole consultant community is wrong? Nooooo!. So all the Oracle University community is wrong? Nooooo!

                          My formula: Teaching < --- > Consulting

                          You cannot be a good instructor without practical knowledge, but you cannot become a good consultant without the theorical knowledge.


                          ~ Madrid
                          http://hrivera99.blogspot.com
                          • 55. Re: My thoughts on OCP
                            639907
                            Dear Madrid,

                            Sorry for this, my intention was not generalize, I still giving classes for OU, I agree with you, we have some exceptions to this rule, but been honest I know several OU instructors oin US, Chile, Brazil, NZ, Argentina, Peru, Mexico, and sorry but they only dedicate their lives being a instructor with a minimal practical experience, and if they had some, will be like DBOs. People like you, me, and several others DBAs are trying to change this situation, that's why we are here using this Forum to try to help other people.

                            Cheers,

                            Francisco Munoz ALvarez
                            • 56. Re: My thoughts on OCP
                              108476
                              Hi Madrid,
                              I DO NOT panic when I have to face real life questions that go far beyond what is being written on the books.
                              Yup, hands-on experience counts, big time. . . .
                              generalizing is not a good practice since the great lies come from generalized paradigms.
                              Oh, good point!

                              When I teach Oracle, the first thing they learn is that the answer to any Oracle question is "It Depends"!

                              On the other hand, you MUST use analogies and over-generalization when teaching beginners concepts. If you throw-in all the "exceptions" they won't understand. I believe in teaching by analogy:

                              http://www.dba-oracle.com/t_learning_by_analogy.htm
                              • 57. Re: My thoughts on OCP
                                Madrid
                                I cannot say that all instructors everywhere in the world have practical experience. I have seen instructors who doesn't take the challenge to improve themselves and they just understand what they are teaching and perform a good show time. Also I have seen very good instructors the kind of instructor that only needs to have the willing to teach and each word coming from him opens

                                I absolutely agree. It means people must have a commitment, both for the consultancy and for the training.

                                I have seen also several consultants who don't take seriously the training. They are chatting with the Messenger while exposing, and don't even try to unplug the internet cable, they scream and they complain about the course.

                                Regards
                                • 58. Re: My thoughts on OCP
                                  108476
                                  don't even try to unplug the internet cable, they scream and they complain about the course.
                                  Ha!

                                  I was teaching Oracle DBA in Germany a while back, and there was a lady in the back row who was surfing Lesbo Porn! Whenever I would walk past (during exercises), she mashed a "hot key" into SQL*Plus. . . .

                                  Thank goodness for PC Anywhere, you can watch the students . . . .
                                  • 59. Re: My thoughts on OCP
                                    Madrid
                                    don't even try to unplug the internet cable, they
                                    scream and they complain about the course.

                                    Ha!

                                    I was teaching Oracle DBA in Germany a while back,
                                    and there was a lady in the back row who was surfing
                                    Lesbo Porn! Whenever I would walk past (during
                                    exercises), she mashed a "hot key" into SQL*Plus. . .
                                    Actually I have never faced such a situation, and usually, the kind of auditorium I have worked with are moderated, just messenger, personal emails, sports, cars, news. And most of the training centers I have worked with have proxies that prevent unauthorized contents. I should point out that surfing whatever during your Class is such a waste of time. I mean, you were the instructor, certainly that lady was not at all interested in learning from whoever was the instructor.


                                    ~ Madrid
                                    http://hrivera99.blogspot.com
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